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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2015 14:13:00 GMT
That we play a back 4 when Rojo plays.
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Post by StrikerMo on Jan 17, 2015 14:15:18 GMT
Ahh I see. Oh well... what does Marc know?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2015 14:16:34 GMT
Good point!
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Post by Jie on Jan 17, 2015 14:25:02 GMT
Well, apparently Evans starts instead of Smalling
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Post by howAREya on Jan 17, 2015 14:45:14 GMT
Hmmm Draw
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Post by Dave on Jan 17, 2015 14:47:22 GMT
Well, apparently Evans starts instead of Smalling Good news.
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Post by Hammy on Jan 17, 2015 14:47:29 GMT
Could be a 4-3-3 with Valencia RB, Rojo LB and Jones, Evans as CBs. Carrick, Blind sitting in the middle, Di Maria sitting in front with Mata, Rooney and Falcao as forwards. Would be the logical set up but we all know VG is anything but logical. Probably see something like this
------------------Falcao----------------
---Di Maria-----Mata-------De Gea----Rooney
--------------Rojo-------Evans-----------
-----------------Jones-------------------
------------Blind---------Valencia-------
-----------------Carrick-----------------
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Post by Hammy on Jan 17, 2015 15:36:28 GMT
And they say Moyes is a tactical dinosaur. Fuck off back to Germany or Spain VG and take your boring, predictable anti football with you.
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Post by matt on Jan 17, 2015 15:54:34 GMT
I can't believe what we're seeing. LVG's stubborness is just unbelievable. He has no excuse if we don't win. I am a huge fan of his, but his tactical decisions of late are ridiculous. Get Mata off, put Herrera in, Put Rooney upfront, and get Di Maria a bit deeper to run at defenders. Why is that so fucking obvious for us?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2015 17:31:57 GMT
For 60 minutes it was as bad as anything we've seen the past month, dominating possession but creating nothing. Di Maria once again up front and Rooney once again in central midfield, nobody but the manager seems to know what he's doing as with a little tweak...swapping both players' positions we'd see a world of difference for me.
Then we switch to a back 4, score almost instantly and looked pretty dangerous for the rest of the match, particularly impressed with Wilson, not just because of his goal but I thought he looked good from the second he stepped onto the pitch. Fair enough we also looked more vulnerable at the back but this club has always been about outscoring the opponent, not playing a formation to specifically make sure you're less susceptible to concede a goal especially against the sort of opposition we played today. Hopefully that half an hour of football will convince the manager to drop the 3-5-2, although I won't hold my breath.
As for positive player performances, thought Rojo was top notch, Blind again played well at wing/full back and as I mentioned was impressed with Wilson. Falcao tried again but just doesn't seem to be fully at it yet in England, Di Maria also falls into that category wasn't impressed by him at all yet again, hopefully if he plays deeper in future games we'll start to see improved performances from him. We all berated Fellaini last season and still do this season (rightfully so) but he made more of an impact than Mata did or has done for weeks. Really don't see a bright future for Mata. Another week and another no show besides about 20 seconds at the end for Herrera, don't see where the manager is coming from with this one, he must be absolutely awful in training because we've started the last few games with 2 guys in Rooney and Mata in central midfield whilst neither are out and out central midfielders.
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Post by Dave on Jan 17, 2015 17:50:12 GMT
The first half was absolutely appalling, apparently our fans chanted 442 at the end. Really needs to ditch this 352, it's didn't work for Holland bar one match and it isn't working for us, yes our defenders may be shit but when you have the attacking quality we have then we need to use it. Much better tempo after we switched it, a little crisper passing, quickly into the attackers rather than the backwards, sideways going nowhere and the added pace of Wilson, Di Maria a little deeper created great opportunities. If he uses it against Cambridge he needs to be shot, if he's going to use it against Leicester then at least change it up, get Di Maria in midfield and drop Mata. Falcao's all round game was good but his finishing woeful, hopefully it will come with better service. Rojo I agree played well, like the look of him, he can be snappy and rash if he eases that up a little, he will go places. Blind with another solid display, Wilson another good cameo and now with his first goal of the season under his belt then I only see more goals ahead for him. To summarise ditch the fucking 352
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Post by matt on Jan 17, 2015 19:06:37 GMT
Herrera being left out is the big mystery for me, because his introduction would solve a lot of the issues we're seeing. I wish we could have some way to understand his omission.
I disagree when people say our defence is shit. Sure we're still bound to make mistake because our defenders are still very young, but from what I see it's in midfield that the issue truly is. There is a lack of connection and mobility in tat CAM position behind our strikers, so much so that we are unable to take advantage of our possession spell. I believe the roots have been built up pretty well by LVG in terms of tactical awareness and possession (although there is still plenty f work to do), but now the times has come to move forward attacking wise or we won't be able to break the best teams.
I wish we could add some bodies behind our strikers closer to each other to penetrate from the middle, especially when you have players like Di Maria, Rooney or Herrera (and even Mata) who can play quick passes/one-touch football and offer great mobility.
All in all, I think that LVG is trying to implement a tactical and "philosophical" change, and I respect that because we're improving on many levels, but at the same time a part of me doesn't understand many of his decisions, such as the basic tactical set up, with Di Maria upfront, Rooney so deep, Herrera left out completely...
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Post by Dave on Jan 17, 2015 19:06:38 GMT
"I know in advance when we play with four midfielders in a diamond that we create more chances," Van Gaal said.
"But then the balance of the team is also weak.
"And you see it because we have created chances but also Queens Park Rangers have, and we have to decide every week how to play. That's the question.
"But with the other system (3-5-2) we played against Tottenham, maybe you remember the first-half - we created six or seven chances more than today and we don't score.
"So it's always the question - are you effective enough?
"Against Southampton away we scored two out of three and we won the game. But it was not because we were the better team.
"Last week (against Southampton) we were the better team but in football it is not always the better team who wins."
I think we know what's coming next time..
He's going on about not having balance with a diamond, then has Rooney a striker and Mata in midfield in this 352... utter bullshit.
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Post by Dave on Jan 17, 2015 19:10:11 GMT
Oh he has an answer on Di Maria
"That is also the reason that Wilson has played in the striker's position, because he also has pace and speed and we have to stretch the pitch," Van Gaal admitted.
"Because when you are not stretching with your strikers the opponent makes the space compact, so you need players who can stretch the pitch.
"So when I changed Di Maria to midfield then I had to put Wilson on to stretch the pitch and that's what is in behind."
He still isn't a striker.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2015 19:26:51 GMT
I'm pretty much in your camp Matt, I see a lot of positives in the way the team plays since Van Gaal came in and think we are a much more solid and dependable side now than under Moyes. This shows in our results, last season we were getting comprehensively beaten and outplayed by all the big sides. This season we're the better side in most games and the ones we're not the better side in we're grinding out results or at least putting up a competitive display, I think people have forgotten too quick just how poor we were under Moyes last season, we were terrible all over the pitch.
No doubt over the last month or so the attacking play hasn't been good enough and he is making more and more questionable decisions. Seems to have coincided with the easing injury situation, when he had no alternative but to play Carrick in central defence and Young at left wing back we were getting results and nobody thought anything of it and if anything people said how much of our success was down to the manager.
Now he's got a full squad to choose from he doesn't seem to know his best side which is understandable due to the amount of injuries we've had, so I'm hoping these limp performances and Van Gaal's odd decision making will start to iron out as he gets more used to having a full squad of players (clutching at straws I know).
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